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Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 6:09 am
by dbr
Nuckertuzzi wrote:The first thing I'd look to are teams who win and what I can see is there aren't a whole lot of "highly skilled yet small" Euros lifting Cups lately.
Bleh. Even accepting the notion that there is an identifiable "trend" that can be reproduced with great success for the sake of argument.. have you happened to note the height, weight and birthplace of the Bruins first line centre?

I know everyone talks about Bergeron but there's a guy who outscored him, saw more icetime than him and potted 4/16 game winners in their 2011 run..

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 6:55 am
by dbr
I'm kind of torn on what I want to happen, now that "win the draft lottery" is out of the equation.

Well - I'm torn on what I want to happen, assuming that nobody in the top five goes way off the board because the easy choice at six is to take the faller.

If everyone above us does what they should, there is a pretty considerable group of players ranked 6-15ish that from what I can tell haven't separated themselves all that much from the pack.

(eg. Nick Ritchie is a great big kid with a real arsenal of shots, but has also already got some baggage in the form of shoulder and concussion injuries; Ehlers is piling up points but is doing it with perhaps the best player in the CHL on his team in one of the more lopsided junior leagues; Nylander is supremely skilled but has a Mason Raymond build; people who follow these kids say Kapanen is right there with the latter two players, but nobody watches him enough for the hype to build the same way; Virtanen is a raw, speedy player with a nose for the net but does 'raw' mean that he's going to develop much vision? Etc..)

If certain teams are amenable to it (and if my profoundly uninformed opinion has any merit in reality) I wouldn't mind the Canucks doing some horse trading and ending up with a couple of 10-14 picks. The Ritchies, Ehlers, Nylanders of the draft are enticing prospects but perhaps not so much that it wouldn't be advantageous to have two of the McCann, Tuch, Virtanen, Kapanen, Perlini, Fleury set.. or one and one if Bob McKenzie is right and a player like Nylander doesn't even go in the top ten.

That said if they do hold onto the pick and if none of the top five players fall to them, at the very least we can be assured that they are in a position to make an informed decision. We know Laurence Gilman personally went to watch Ehlers play (something Canucks brass rarely do), Ritchie is right in our OHL wheelhouse, and Nylander plays in Thomas Gradin's territory and has been in the Modo system for that matter (not to mention his father is a former Gillis client, hopefully whatever intelligence MG possessed on this kid has been gleaned and recorded already).

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 7:27 am
by Topper
Shrinkwrap and the 6th to move up and take a Sam.

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 8:10 am
by Diehard1
dbr wrote:I'm kind of torn on what I want to happen, now that "win the draft lottery" is out of the equation.

Well - I'm torn on what I want to happen, assuming that nobody in the top five goes way off the board because the easy choice at six is to take the faller.

If everyone above us does what they should, there is a pretty considerable group of players ranked 6-15ish that from what I can tell haven't separated themselves all that much from the pack.

(eg. Nick Ritchie is a great big kid with a real arsenal of shots, but has also already got some baggage in the form of shoulder and concussion injuries; Ehlers is piling up points but is doing it with perhaps the best player in the CHL on his team in one of the more lopsided junior leagues; Nylander is supremely skilled but has a Mason Raymond build; people who follow these kids say Kapanen is right there with the latter two players, but nobody watches him enough for the hype to build the same way; Virtanen is a raw, speedy player with a nose for the net but does 'raw' mean that he's going to develop much vision? Etc..)

If certain teams are amenable to it (and if my profoundly uninformed opinion has any merit in reality) I wouldn't mind the Canucks doing some horse trading and ending up with a couple of 10-14 picks. The Ritchies, Ehlers, Nylanders of the draft are enticing prospects but perhaps not so much that it wouldn't be advantageous to have two of the McCann, Tuch, Virtanen, Kapanen, Perlini, Fleury set.. or one and one if Bob McKenzie is right and a player like Nylander doesn't even go in the top ten.

That said if they do hold onto the pick and if none of the top five players fall to them, at the very least we can be assured that they are in a position to make an informed decision. We know Laurence Gilman personally went to watch Ehlers play (something Canucks brass rarely do), Ritchie is right in our OHL wheelhouse, and Nylander plays in Thomas Gradin's territory and has been in the Modo system for that matter (not to mention his father is a former Gillis client, hopefully whatever intelligence MG possessed on this kid has been gleaned and recorded already).
When did Ritchie become injury prone? He had a concussion 2 years ago and a shoulder injury last year, yet he's injury prone? A guy like Jared McCann had a concussion last year in the playoffs, is he injury prone as well? I find it odd that people are making out like Ritchie has this lengthy history for some reason. He's missed 28 games over the past 2 seasons, they vast majority (21) because of his shoulder that seems to be fine now. For comparison Sam Bennett has missed 19 regular season games and is missing the U-18s because of an injury but nobody is calling his history concerning. I just find it odd.

For me, you grab a player like Ritchie or Draisaitl and it sets up your rebuild/retool well - with Ritchie, Jensen, Horvat, Gaunce and Kassian all well over 200 pounds you can pick smaller skilled guys to fill in around them like Shinkaruk, Nylander, Robby Fabbri or whoever else. Those guys are much easier to find than big and skilled. Ritchie would set up the team nicely for the future - big, skilled guy who may be able to pot 20-30 in the future? Yes please, especially considering he's got a mean streak and likes contact, meaning he will fit in very well in the playoffs.

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 8:11 am
by ukcanuck
Nuckertuzzi wrote:The first thing is to identify players who you believe will make the bigs and live up to potential, and from that list go for the guy you can picture a champion. I somehow get the feeling a guy like Trev knows what I'm talking about. I hope so.
Bahaha !! :) :)

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 8:39 am
by Topper
Diehard1 wrote:When did Ritchie become injury prone? He had a concussion 2 years ago and a shoulder injury last year,
So he can answer the question that haunts us.

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 9:20 am
by The Brown Wizard
If possible, I'd like to see whomever they pick to be a good skater to offset the perceived skating issues with our existing top 2 centre prospects. Before y'all flip out, Bo and Brendan are steady skaters but lack that breakaway gear.

Here's an old breakdown of the top draft eligible players:
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/juniors/ ... nhl-draft/

I was fairly high on Draisaitl(sp?) but if Nick Ritchie is around still at 6 it would be hard to pass up that kind of potential...6'2" 230 lbs @ 18? Kids a tank

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 9:28 am
by Betamax
Topper wrote:Shrinkwrap and the 6th to move up and take a Sam.
Who's Shrinkwrap? I hope you aren't referring to The Hunter.

I doubt the Oilers would trade that pick unless they also get a good roster player that can help their team now.

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 9:31 am
by rats19
Betamax wrote:
Topper wrote:Shrinkwrap and the 6th to move up and take a Sam.
Who's Shrinkwrap? I hope you aren't referring to The Hunter.

I doubt the Oilers would trade that pick unless they also get a good roster player that can help their team now.
Shinkaruk....

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 9:37 am
by Betamax
rats19 wrote:
Betamax wrote:
Topper wrote:Shrinkwrap and the 6th to move up and take a Sam.
Who's Shrinkwrap? I hope you aren't referring to The Hunter.

I doubt the Oilers would trade that pick unless they also get a good roster player that can help their team now.
Shinkaruk....
A step backwards. The Canucks currently have no forward in their prospect pool with high end offensive potential other than him. | haven't seen him play much outside of highlights but I like the kid's attitude. I think I read a story about him where he broke his leg during his midget year, and instead of taking it easy, he still worked on his stickhandling skills.

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:23 am
by Hockey Widow
Nuckertuzzi wrote:
Hockey Widow wrote:Burke is known for surprising people with his 1st pick, other than the Sedins that is.
Hmm...could he repeat history and move up to secure the other brother??

I'm kinda lost. Who is the other brother and of whom? Not being an ass, I just don't know.

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:40 am
by givemeda411
Sam & Max Reinhart

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:40 am
by herb
Barring a major drop of one of the big three, I would be very happy with Draisatl, Dal Colle, Ritchie or Virtanen. All are guys with size who play in the tough areas and put up points from what I have read.

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 11:44 am
by Nuckertuzzi
dbr wrote:Bleh. Even accepting the notion that there is an identifiable "trend" that can be reproduced with great success for the sake of argument.. have you happened to note the height, weight and birthplace of the Bruins first line centre?

Did say there are few exceptions. The Bruins 'small' guys are full of jam and Krejci is not exactly small, not to mention they're surrounded by guys who help add a few inches and pounds to their size.

I realize I am over generalizing but don't care..seen too many soft tiny Euros that add to the stereotype to believe it's more than just a trend.

I guess the problem is we need to build a foundation first before trying to identify players who'll play big and raise their game when it matters most. But why not try and build that foundation with those type of players?

Re: Welcome to the Dark Side Minions: The Top Draft Prospect

Posted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 1:40 pm
by Diehard1
Nuckertuzzi wrote:
dbr wrote:Bleh. Even accepting the notion that there is an identifiable "trend" that can be reproduced with great success for the sake of argument.. have you happened to note the height, weight and birthplace of the Bruins first line centre?

Did say there are few exceptions. The Bruins 'small' guys are full of jam and Krejci is not exactly small, not to mention they're surrounded by guys who help add a few inches and pounds to their size.

I realize I am over generalizing but don't care..seen too many soft tiny Euros that add to the stereotype to believe it's more than just a trend.

I guess the problem is we need to build a foundation first before trying to identify players who'll play big and raise their game when it matters most. But why not try and build that foundation with those type of players?
The nice thing is after this draft, assuming they take one of Ritchie/DalColle/Draisaitl - size shouldn't be an issue with Jensen, Kassian, Horvat, and Gaunce all possibly on the team within the next couple of years. It will be a big team that should be able to play with anybody.