I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

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Topper
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

Post by Topper »

Strangelove wrote:No doubt, that Wideman text is much like most Bountiful posts today.

Lots of ranting over there about the NHL Versus Calgary Flames Conspiracy Theory.

Ummmmm.....
Canuck's should pick him up to play with Burrows.
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

Post by Strangelove »

Topper wrote: Canuck's should pick him up to play with Burrows.
Now cut that out! :evil:

Would've been soooo funny if Bettman increased the suspension. :)
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

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Topper wrote:
Bettman added that he was troubled by Wideman's "total failure to accept any responsibility for his actions." He noted that while Wideman made much at the appeal hearing about apologizing to Henderson, "The sincerity of those apologies rings somewhat hollow, given the text message he sent to a teammate on February 2 -- after the conclusion of the hearing before (vice president of hockey operations Colin Campbell) -- that 'the only problem and the only reason I'm here is cause the stupid refs and stupid media.'"
Now read all of Bettman's 22 page decision. He tears the NHLPA and their expert witnesses a new one for their shoddy contradictory and vague reports and testimony. The experts conducted brief Facetime interviews with Wideman while he was on a golf vacation in Arizona during the All Star break. LOL

This is why Bettman received an extension from the owners. The guy is a pitbull.
If Calgary was smart :lol: I cracked myself up with that one they would let this go and move on... I gotta new found respect for our Commish after today... Shakey head Bettman probably 3 steps away from full blown Alzheimers or maybe he is a recovering alcoholic either way he showed the world in Public what the owners behind closed doors already know...

Which is Gary Bettman is Fierce as Fck....
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

Post by Strangelove »

olpaddy wrote: If Calgary was smart :lol: I cracked myself up with that one they would let this go and move on...
:wink:

Brian Burke's reaction today to Bettman's ruling:
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/bria ... uspension/

“We disagree vehemently with the decision that was reached here,” Burke told Tim and Sid. “We were astonished by it, we don’t understand it, we disagree with it completely.”

“We’ve been asking for a result for several days, saying ‘when’s this going to come down?’ Because now, if this is appealed to the neutral arbitrator, they’ve virtually guaranteed that the player’s going to do 10 games no matter what because it’s going to take a couple days to get this thing put all together,” Burke said. “So to take a week to rubber-stamp a decision that was made by the hockey operations department of the National Hockey League as games tick off for my player, that affect my team’s ability to win, that affect playoff races, that affect competitive balance, is incomprehensible to me.”

Burke added: “We’re not questioning the integrity of the process — the appeal has gone to the commissioner, if all he’s going to do is rubber-stamp it we accept that, but then do it quickly so it can get to this third party. The only objection we have here is the timing of this and of course we disagree with the first decision. We believe this was an accidental collision between our player — a player with an 800-game career almost with no prior instance, never had a major penalty other than fighting majors, never got a five for hitting from behind, never got a high-sticking foul, never had an issue with an official.

“If you look at these Rule 40 offences they fall into two categories: Either this player had a beef with the official involved or he had a beef with another player and was disrespectful to an official. So he’s either trying to settle a score or he’s trying to settle a score with a player and disregards an official in the process. This is not that case. This is a player that’s trying to get to the bench.”
Burke gonna burke...
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

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Strangelove wrote:Brian Burke's reaction today to Bettman's ruling:
http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/bria ... uspension/

“We disagree vehemently with the decision that was reached here,” Burke told Tim and Sid. “We were astonished by it, we don’t understand it, we disagree with it completely.”

“We’ve been asking for a result for several days, saying ‘when’s this going to come down?’ Because now, if this is appealed to the neutral arbitrator, they’ve virtually guaranteed that the player’s going to do 10 games no matter what because it’s going to take a couple days to get this thing put all together,” Burke said. “So to take a week to rubber-stamp a decision that was made by the hockey operations department of the National Hockey League as games tick off for my player, that affect my team’s ability to win, that affect playoff races, that affect competitive balance, is incomprehensible to me.”

Burke added: “We’re not questioning the integrity of the process — the appeal has gone to the commissioner, if all he’s going to do is rubber-stamp it we accept that, but then do it quickly so it can get to this third party."
So Burke isn't questioning the process, he's suggesting the appeal was a sham with the result was predetermined, and saying Bettman needn't do a thorough review of the evidence and testimony.
"The only objection we have here is the timing of this and of course we disagree with the first decision. We believe this was an accidental collision between our player — a player with an 800-game career almost with no prior instance, never had a major penalty other than fighting majors, never got a five for hitting from behind, never got a high-sticking foul, never had an issue with an official."
Bettman dealt with all of that in his written decision, and used it as a reason for not adding to the suspension handed down by Colin Campbell.
"If you look at these Rule 40 offences they fall into two categories: Either this player had a beef with the official involved or he had a beef with another player and was disrespectful to an official. So he’s either trying to settle a score or he’s trying to settle a score with a player and disregards an official in the process. This is not that case. This is a player that’s trying to get to the bench.”
No, if you look at Rule 40 as a guideline, as Bettman and Campbell did in their decisions, offences fall into two categories, 1)those with intent to injure, or where intent to injure should be known; and 2) those without intent.

Intent carries an automatic 20 games, no intent, an automatic 10 games. As Bettman noted, Wideman and the PA asked for no suspension at all. They did not use Rule 40 as a guideline and suggest a reduction to 10 games was in order because of a lack of intent. They felt Wideman committed no foul whatsoever.......and Gary pointed out the PA was so lax in their appeal documents, they didn't suggest a lessor sentence other than zero games. It was another waste of a Manilla envelope.

To think that Burke used to have Campbell's job and yet comes out with that nonsense.

Dinsdale!
Last edited by Topper on Thu Feb 18, 2016 4:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

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olpaddy wrote: I gotta new found respect for our Commish after today... Shakey head Bettman probably 3 steps away from full blown Alzheimers or maybe he is a recovering alcoholic either way he showed the world in Public what the owners behind closed doors already know...

Which is Gary Bettman is Fierce as Fck....
I read a Bettman appeal decision a few years ago where he detailed the CBA rules on supplimentary discipline and came that same conclusion.

He may look and sound like the Chihuahua bobble head in the rear window of your parents '66 Chrysler Newport, but the guy is a pitbull. A very smart pitbull.
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

Post by Puck »

Wideman clearly smokes the guy, from behind, in the neck/head. Who does that while apparently dazed from a concussion? If he'd accidentally skated into him from behind and knocked him over (while also falling over himself), then I'd believe that defense. The whole appeal is ridiculous. If you even touch a ref in the NFL you're ejected. 20 games seems fine. Move on, Flames. Move on.
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

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Tinordi 20 games suspended for performance enhancing substance...
Arizona Coyotes defenseman Jarred Tinordi will miss the remainder of the 2015-16 season after being handed a 20-game suspension for violating the NHL’s performance enhancing substances program.

The NHL announced Tinordi’s suspension Wednesday afternoon, adding that the 24-year-old’s suspension will be “accompanied by mandatory referral to the NHL/NHLPA Program for Substance Abuse and Behavioral Health for evaluation and possible treatment.” He will also forfeit his for the duration of the ban.

“I am extremely disappointed that I failed a test under the NHL/NHLPA Performance Enhancing Substances Program,” Tinordi said in a statement. “I did not knowingly take a banned substance. I understand, however, that I am responsible for what enters my body as a professional athlete and I accept the suspension. I will work hard towards my return to the ice and will learn from this frustrating setback.”​

Coyotes GM Don Maloney said the team learned of Tinordi’s impending suspension Tuesday afternoon. Maloney added that the Coyotes support the league’s decision to suspend Tinordi, saying the Coyotes will support the young blueliner “throughout this process.”

Tinordi is the second player to be hit with a 20-game suspension for violating the performance enhancing substances policy this season. In late-January, Anaheim Ducks veteran winger Shawn Horcoff was given an identical 20-game suspension for violating the terms of the policy, a ban Horcoff said was caused by a treatment he received to recover from a wrist injury. Tinordi has not yet revealed what he believes caused his suspension.
http://www.thehockeynews.com/blog/coyot ... es-policy/
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

Post by Tciso »

Strangelove wrote:...

Image

:hmmm:
Watching the play, I tend to believe Wideman. He really didn't see the linesman coming. Good chance his peripheral vision was FUBAR at the moment. He lifts his arms for an unexpected impact. But....his head stays focused on the bench the entire time. He was in la-la land when the collision occured. If this was a court trial, and not the Bettman Sham, Wideman woulda been found innocent, as he didn't have intent.
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

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Tciso wrote:Watching the play, I tend to believe Wideman. He really didn't see the linesman coming. Good chance his peripheral vision was FUBAR at the moment. He lifts his arms for an unexpected impact. But....his head stays focused on the bench the entire time. He was in la-la land when the collision occured. If this was a court trial, and not the Bettman Sham, Wideman woulda been found innocent, as he didn't have intent.
Read the rulebook on official abuse. Read the Bettman ruling. Rule 40, which is used as a guideline only because no penalty was assessed on the play.

No intent - automatic 10 games
Intent - automatic 20 games

Wideman/Flames/PA asked for no games. If they had asked for a reduction to 10, they may have gotten it, Who knows. But when Wideman texted a team mate he was only at the hearing "cause of the stupid ref and the stupid media" he removed any evidence of contrition for his act.

Go back and read how twisted, contradictory and superficial the concussion experts from the Flames/PA/Wideman side were. These experts interviewed Wideman over Skype while Wideman was on a golf vacation. Wideman/Flames/PA concussion experts don't agree with your assessment.
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

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Tcisco... you HAVE seen guys try to skate off with concussions before, right? Guys can barely stand up. Wideman skates cleanly, shows no wobble at all, makes an evasive stop/turn and quickly raises his hands up to brace for impact all while being "in LA-LA land"?

Uh. Ok.

And when was the last time you braced for impact by cross-checking someone in the head?
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

Post by DonCherry4PM »

Without getting in depth on the proper application of the rules to the incident and solely from watching the replay, I would tend to agree with Tcisco that the event has at least some appearance of being unintentional. From the replay, it appears that Wideman is focused on the bench and nothing else (as Tcisco noted his head barely moves even at the time of the collision as he keeps looking towards the bench) - when the ref comes into his vision he skates to the right (apparently to avoid the collision) and lifts his arms. If he is telling the truth and didn't see the ref until the last second, lifting his hands would be a normal reflex action. That said, who knows how much his bell was wrung or whether there was any intent or malice in the hit.

With respect to the text, I don't think that it necessarily shows a lack of contrition. The guy could be sorry for the hit and still not feel that it should have been elevated to the extent it has been or that the ref (given his apology) showed understanding for what he claims is an unintentional act.

As for Bettman, while we might not agree with many of his decisions I don't think there is any arguing this guy is as sharp as a tack.
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

Post by Hockey Widow »

Read the full transcript. Bettman deals with the issue very well. He finds Wideman is not credible. He changed his story and offered no real explanation. Admitted at one point he saw the linesman and just was trying to get to the bench. Changes his story to not remembering, to not seeing anyone. But if you read it it is pretty clear Bettman does not believe him. Further Bettman points out his apparent lack of remorse.
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

Post by KeyserSoze »

His lack of remorse immediately after was telling.

My thoughts - he was sore and more so pissed off that there was no penalty on the hit in the corner...going to the bench he appears to be in discomfort and my guess is that he thought it was a Pred player getting in his way, and out of anger gave a shove.

I don't think he realized it was a linesman when he made the shove, but his lack of care immediately after (when it was clear that it was an official) tells me he either didn't give a fuck in the moment, or was a bit shocked and did not want to immediately take responsibility for what just happened.

Regardless, 20 games makes sense to me.
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Re: I can't believe it's NOT a suspension!

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Friday night is game 20.
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